March 2003 - Oberon - mailman3.inf.ethz.ch

Problem with NIL Check (NIL Page Access)
by Fernando Passold 19 Mar '03

19 Mar '03

Hello people, I am trying to use the: Oberon System 3 for WindowsTM Win32 2.3 (25.2.1999) on Windows NT 5.0 because this is the only one S.O. available to put to run a real SCARA robot... I think that today there is a new and better version but unfortunately I must to deal with this version. The big problem is that frequently I receive this mesage: [BEGIN | EXCEPTION] - Trap kind: NIL Check (NIL Page Access) - Task Entry: TelnetServer.SessionHandler.Run - Task Id: 11 - Task Status: Halted - Trapped Procedure Frame: Modules.CheckScope - Current Instruction Pointer: 0003B660H - Relative PC: 8528 - Stack Dump Follows: Modules.CheckScope PC: 8528 dsc = 0 elem = NIL fp = 541683299 i = 0 level = -1 link = 1869443169 tadr = NIL tdadr = 8689208 Modules.CheckScope PC: 8676 ... and so on.... And this occours after I command: "XO> Main.CreateRobot ~" (the first one to use to initialize all the variables of the system to controll the robot)... And the system hangs up after this... I was thinkig it occours because the lenght of the code (over than 65Kbytes), and this system (maybe) are not prepared to point memory locations (pointers) above 2^{16}... But maybe this is not the reason because I have made cuts in the code to srink it but the problem persists. Someone could "give me a light" to fix this problem? At least, to suggest how I could manage this kind of information to discover were is located the error? thanks in advance, Fernando ............................. FeRnando Passold PhD Doctor Student at DAS/LAI - UFSC - Florianópolis/SC - BRAZIL www.das.ufsc.br/~fpassold/SCARA

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Re (3): [Oberon] Win32 Plugin Oberon, status report II
by Edgar＠EdgarSchwarz.de 18 Mar '03

18 Mar '03

John Drake <jmdrake_98(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > I feel that delegates make sense (For more on > > delegates have a look at C#). > > You're probably right on that. Like I said I can > see how this adds flexibility. I wasn't aware > C# had something like that. But I'm still not > sure how definining a method and assigning it > to a procedure variable in Active Oberon is any > different than defining a procedure and > assigning it to a procedure variable in > Oberon-1. Perhaps you could simulate it (Wasn't there a discussion with Ulrich :-?) The difference is in assignment compatibility I guess. With delegates prodecures with 'different' signatures are compatible because the implicit object parameter a method has isn't compared so you have more flexibility. > > BTW my first problem came with you AosFS. It seems > > like PluginOberon.Files > > and Native.Files have some differences. > > If you are interested I could give you some details. > Yes. I would certainly be interested. In AosFS.Mod you sent me: Rider* = RECORD (Files.Rider); (** not shareable between multiple processes *) (* the rider must be a record, otherwise the Oberon text system will not work *) (** private fields for implementors *) apos*, bpos*: LONGINT; hint*: Hint; file*: File; END; but in Native Files.Rider already has apos, bpos, hint and even file, but a 'Files.File' naturally IIRC. So there is a conflict. I'm not sure yet about the best fix. > without delegates, though I think the port is > more work than either of us first thought. Agreed. I didn't expect the delegates problem. But even Patrik Reali was surprised. So perhaps I missed something. > taking a look at the DAV code again. You're on > version 7 right? Module WebDAV.Mod uses delegates > for the objects ChunkedOutStream and > ChunkedInStream. That's where the problem appeared for me. > Another thought that this brings mind another idea > I've been kicking around for awhile. I call it > the "convergent Oberon project". Here I see some problems. But no time to lay them down this evening. Cheers, Edgar -- edgar(a)edgarschwarz.de "http://www.edgarschwarz.de" "http://www.edgar-schwarz.de/forum/oberon" Running Active Oberon Make it as simple as possible, but not simpler. Albert Einstein

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Re (2): [Oberon] Win32 Plugin Oberon, status report II
by Edgar＠EdgarSchwarz.de 18 Mar '03

18 Mar '03

> John Drake <jmdrake_98(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > --- Felix Friedrich <friedrich(a)gsf.de> wrote: > > I am currently working at the core of the new > > PluginOberon, parts are > > AosIO, Filesystems etc., so I think when this is > > done, porting WebDAV > > shouldn't make any problems (hopefully). > > I would have expected, that AosIO works with > > NativeOberon also, since it > > doesn't contain any active Object keywords (like > > AWAIT, EXCLUSIVE etc.) > > What kind of problems occured when you tried to > > assign the Sender variable ? > > > > Cheers, Felix. > > AosIO does include the active oberon specific > keyword "DELEGATE". It's easy to miss this > because it has (apparently) nothing to do with > multitasking. Instead it's used to allow > assigning of procedure variables to methods. > Specifically: > > TYPE > Sender* = PROCEDURE {DELEGATE} (VAR buf......) I feel that delegates make sense (For more on delegates have a look at C#). But for the purpose of the WebDAV client for Native it should be possible to do the sending and reveiving to the TCP/IP connection without this AosIO feature. BTW my first problem came with you AosFS. It seems like PluginOberon.Files and Native.Files have some differences. If you are interested I could give you some details. But so be it. I still think that a Native client would be worth some work. OTOH I expect it to be easier with an upcoming new PluginOberon release. Cheers, Edgar -- edgar(a)edgarschwarz.de "http://www.edgarschwarz.de" "http://www.edgar-schwarz.de/forum/oberon" Running Active Oberon Make it as simple as possible, but not simpler. Albert Einstein

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Re: [Oberon] Win32 Plugin Oberon, status report II
by Edgar＠EdgarSchwarz.de 17 Mar '03

17 Mar '03

Felix Friedrich <friedrich(a)gsf.de>: > hope to get PluginAos starting up during the weekend, > IF so THEN > SYSTEM.PUT(Champaign, Mouth(Felix)) (* nearly done .... ;) *) > ELSE > SYSTEM.PUT(Beer, Mouth(SYSTEM.VAL(Felix, picture of misery))) (* more > work waiting ;( *) I hope that you can open the Champaign today :-) I would like to try to port my WebDAV client to PluginOberon. Because when I tried to port it to Native (November 2001) I found that I had problems with the port of AosIO when trying to assign methods to the AosIO.Sender variable. So my qestion is whether this should work or isn't this stuff supported by the Native compiler of November 2001 ? Perhaps an upgrade to a newer Native would help ? Cheers, Edgar -- edgar(a)edgarschwarz.de "http://www.edgarschwarz.de" "http://www.edgar-schwarz.de/forum/oberon" Running Active Oberon Make it as simple as possible, but not simpler. Albert Einstein

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Win32 Plugin Oberon, status report
by Felix Friedrich 14 Mar '03

14 Mar '03

Hi everybody, I am still working at the new PluginOberon for Windows Version, here is the current status: - Full compatility with the recent Bluebottle/Native Compiler, was harder than expected since I needed a temporary workaround for the new interface of OPT when loading modules compiled with the old version. - Removed the Windows registry dependency nearly everywhere, in particular the Modules belonging to the inner core (->Oberon.exe) make no use of the Registry any more - Currently working on Active Objects. I have managed Active Objects to start and execute the {ACTIVE} body. Will now use Threads to make it running concurrently with other objects. Then will also try to get Lock, Unlock and Await running. The biggest part was to understand AosLoader and AosActive ... in detail but I'm looking forward to finish that part. Let me repeat: If there are any wishes (or objections) for the (core of the) "new" System, please let me know. Felix. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP 8.0 (Build 294) Beta iQA/AwUBPb0WlkxdycIDx9VEEQLNcQCfV6Vvh6xm8wgomQ6Fy1fuGjXFq0IAn1qT 3wWElF69eNppXaSyxI2tKEhL =rmRz -----END PGP SIGNATURE------- Felix Friedrich Institut für Biomathematik und Biometrie GSF - Forschungszentrum für Umwelt und Gesundheit, GmbH Ingolstädter Landstraße 1, D-85764 Neuherberg Tel: ++49 89 3187 2436 email: friedrich(a)gsf.de --

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Antwort: DAV porting question (was Re (2): [Oberon] PC.Compile singularities)
by Edgar Schwarz 06 Mar '03

06 Mar '03

Hi John, don't care about DAVFonts ! DAVFonts, DAVObjects and DAVTexts are just "bluebottled" versions of Native Fonts, Objects and Texts. On Native you should just remove the ... := DAV... in the appropriate Import statements and be done. You also need not care about porting the whole client. If you managed XML, XMLScanner, XMLObjects, XMLParser (more ?) then just be done and send it to me because the client side already changed in the meantime. Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards Edgar Schwarz -- Edgar.Schwarz(a)marconi.com, Postf. 1920, D-71509 Backnang,+49 7191 13 3382, Marconi Communications, Access Division, Quality and Process Improvement Privat kann jeder soviel C programmieren oder Videos ansehen wie er mag (Niklaus Wirth). Make it as simple as possible, but not simpler (A.Einstein) John Drake <jmdrake_98@yah An: oberon(a)inf.ethz.ch oo.com> Kopie: Gesendet von: Blindkopie: oberon-admin@in Thema: DAV porting question (was Re (2): [Oberon] PC.Compile singularities) f.ethz.ch 06.03.2003 16:19 Bitte antworten an oberon Hello Edgar, I've been a little off focus on the DAV port, but I'm looking at it again. Now I've got XML just about ported, but it's other BlueBottle dependencies that have be held up like DAVFonts. Specifically DAVFonts imports module Kernel. Most of what Kernel does in DAVFonts seems to be doable with Out.String and Out.Ln, but there is a call to Kernel.GetConfig: PROCEDURE Init; VAR s: ARRAY 8 OF CHAR; BEGIN FontId := Objects.LibBlockId; NEW(theChar); Kernel.GetConfig("FontConv", s); conv := s[0] # "0"; Objects.Register("Fnt", New) END Init; What's the purpose of this code, and is it needed on non-BlueBottle systems? Regards, John M. Drake --- Edgar(a)EdgarSchwarz.de wrote: > I guess I had a similar problem with my version > control stuff. In VCSBase > and DAVDeltavBase I'm using Oberon Texts which > aren't available on Bluebottle. > So I sort of "bluebottled" them. On > ketchup:FAT:/es/httproot/dav you can find > es.DAVObjects.Mod, es.DAVFonts.Mod and > es.DAVTexts.Mod which especially don't > depend on Native Files any more. > I'm not sure but perhaps this could be useful to > you. > > Cheers, Edgar > > -- > edgar(a)edgarschwarz.de > "http://www.edgarschwarz.de" > "http://www.edgar-schwarz.de/forum/oberon" > Running Active Oberon > Make it as simple as possible, but not simpler. > Albert Einstein > -- > Oberon(a)inf.ethz.ch mailing list for ETH Oberon and > related systems > http://www.lists.inf.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/oberon __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ -- Oberon(a)inf.ethz.ch mailing list for ETH Oberon and related systems http://www.lists.inf.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/oberon

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Re (2): [Oberon] PC.Compile singularities
by Edgar＠EdgarSchwarz.de 06 Mar '03

06 Mar '03

Hi Patrik, "Patrik Reali" <reali(a)acm.org> wrote: > > REPEAT > > Texts.Read(r, ch) > > UNTIL r.eot OR ((r.lib # NIL) & (r.lib IS Fonts.Font)); > > > > the objects are just discarded, which is fine, but the "char > > index" does not increase, so you get the errors reported before their > > actual position. I have changed those lines with > > > > This problem is quite a hassle: I'm trying to make the whole Paco an Aos > application (i.e. it can be invoked from the Aos command line without having > to load the whole Oberon IDE), but most of the texts we are using are Oberon > texts. For this reason, the main module of the compiler has to understand > the oberon text format (would require to duplicate all the text parsing > code) or rely on some external libraries (e.g. AosTexts). Obviously the > problem is not to lose the synchronization with the text (for emitting error > positions). I guess I had a similar problem with my version control stuff. In VCSBase and DAVDeltavBase I'm using Oberon Texts which aren't available on Bluebottle. So I sort of "bluebottled" them. On ketchup:FAT:/es/httproot/dav you can find es.DAVObjects.Mod, es.DAVFonts.Mod and es.DAVTexts.Mod which especially don't depend on Native Files any more. I'm not sure but perhaps this could be useful to you. Cheers, Edgar -- edgar(a)edgarschwarz.de "http://www.edgarschwarz.de" "http://www.edgar-schwarz.de/forum/oberon" Running Active Oberon Make it as simple as possible, but not simpler. Albert Einstein

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Re: [Oberon] Win32 Plugin Oberon, status report
by Edgar＠EdgarSchwarz.de 05 Mar '03

05 Mar '03

Felix Friedrich <friedrich(a)gsf.de> wrote: > Hi everybody, > I am still working at the new PluginOberon for Windows Version, Good to hear. > Let me repeat: If there are any wishes (or objections) for the (core of > the) "new" System, please let me know. I remember that I needed slightly different code for enumerating directories with Native and PluginOberon a while ago. So it would be nice to go with the Bluebottle way also for PluginOberon. Also I still hope that XML will be supported in the new version :-) Cheers, Edgar -- edgar(a)edgarschwarz.de "http://www.edgarschwarz.de" "http://www.edgar-schwarz.de/forum/oberon" Running Active Oberon Make it as simple as possible, but not simpler. Albert Einstein

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_The Oberon System_, Ch. 15, Module Oberon
by peter_easthope＠gulfnet.sd64.bc.ca 05 Mar '03

05 Mar '03

Seeing as how I am copying this chapter for Chris, another copy or two would not be difficult. If anyone else really needs it, please notify me before Thursday, March 6. If there are more than two requests only the first two will be honored. Regards, Peter E. http://carnot.pathology.ubc.ca/

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Re: painfull edit/compile/run cycle !
by eas-lab＠absamail.co.za 01 Mar '03

01 Mar '03

> > How do I identify a module's callers, so that I can > > System.Free <client-list> , instead of rebooting > > for each edit/compile/run cycle ? Doug wrote: > I usually create a file with a list of all the modules that are being > used for the current project on which I am working. The list is ordered > from no dependency to maximum dependency so that > System.Free <selection> > will free all the working set modules. I know the dependency since I > created the project. Some versions of free (Browser.Free?) do the > ordering for you. OK. But I just want to wrap a 3 line routine in an existing module of mine, to avoid file proliferation. I have'nt got a list of it's callers, and the matter is suposed to be trivial - not a 'project'. John M. Drake wrote: > System.ShowModules shows the list of currently loaded modules from > the top down. So I usually mark everything from the top down to > the module I actually wish to unload and click the "Free" button. > And you're right, before I figured this out that was quite painful. > Also you might want to try Watson.ShowExports . This worked on > System 3 for Windows version 2.3, but not Plugin Oberon. > That way you might unload even more modules than necessary. > The reference count yields the number of modules that have > to be unloaded first before the module in case can be freed. > To find out which modules actually refer to the module in case > you easily check the loaded modules' import lists. It is not > necessary to take care of indirect imports because there would > be at least one directly importing module which has to be freed > first. Yes, that's what I mean by 'painful'. Why is this not automated ? OK. Desktops.OpenDoc Popups.Tool ~ [System] > System.Free ^ tries to remove the selected set. But the listing sequence is chronological not 'dependancy'. Interestingly since I don't use Popups.Tool , it was near the top of the list and trapped when I tries to free modules below it. eg. because it uses ColorWells , Clocks. OTOH we see: ColorWells 7542 0 Clocks 9771 0 This is confusing: I understand that the Popups.Tool panel can't remove the gadget which belongs to itself - whereas System.Free ^ can. But why are ColorWells and Clocks ref-count shown as zero while Popups.Tool panel is still 'alive' ? Ulrich <whywouldyousendspam(a)microsoft.com> wrote: > Rebooting! This is the best joke for a long time :-) No. Re-booting takes a few seconds. Plus 10 seconds to find & re-load the needed frames. ========= OK let's automate this often needed task ? How does System.ShowModules know the reference count ? PROCEDURE ShowModules*; VAR M: Modules.Module; .. .... Texts.WriteInt(W, M.refcnt, 1); Texts.WriteLn(W); <-- there's the refCount. -> Watson.ShowDef Modules == Modules.Def ... TYPE Module = Kernel.Module; -> Kernel.Def -> ... Module= POINTER TO ModuleDesc; -> ModuleDesc= RECORD ... refcnt, sb: LONGINT; <-- there's the refCount. Without giving much though, I hoped for perhaps a linked-list of mod-names. Apparently not. -------------- Let's extend Watson ? PROCEDURE Imports; (* writes import list to W *) VAR i, j: INTEGER; first, ln: BOOLEAN; PROCEDURE OutCmnt(cmnt: Cmnt); BEGIN ... IF first THEN first:= FALSE; Keywords(cmnts.next, "IMPORT",mod[0].ln, TRUE) ELSE Char(",") END; -------------- Or just let Watson export the "Imports" proc, and recursively use it to list the dependancy tree - or is it a DAG ? Who's going to do it ? I'm busy these days. -- Chris Glur. PS. I found the caller modules by searching *.Mod for "<ModuleToBeReloaded>" , but this is not good since the sources may not be available.

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