February 2015 - Oberon - mailman3.inf.ethz.ch

Oberon / Linux Revival
by Peter Matthias 09 Mar '15

09 Mar '15

Hi all, in case someone is interested: I uploaded a proof of concept of a multi binary distribution of Oberon on the Linux kernel to https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6eJZR_nlqauODdGVDUwd0Q3OGM/view?usp=shari… . It runs on ARM, MIPS and X86. Just extract the tgz file, go into olr directory and run ./ola (ARM) ./olm (MIPS) or ./olx (X86). It compiles itself, X86 version also compiles MIPS and ARM. All source and some instructions are included. Have fun. Peter

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Re: [Oberon] Oberon / Linux Revival (rPi alternative)
by skulski＠pas.rochester.edu 25 Feb '15

25 Feb '15

> I'm asking what are the low-wattage consumption ETHO-able systems. The Beagle series of boards backed by Texas Instruments, especially BeagleBone Black (www.beaglebone.org) It is the same price range as rPi, but it is true open source. You can load the design files and you can modify them to produce your own derivative boards to suit your needs. Most important, you can build these boards because you can buy the processors. You can build the exact copies of BeagleBone if you wish so, though it makes little sense because you can just buy these. Or, most importantly, you can build your modified versions. The biggest impediment of rPi is that it is available from only one place due to Broadcomm hold on the processor and the personal union between Broadcom and the rPi Foundation (both run by the same person). Broadcomm has killed the competing rPi clones by simply refusing to sell the CPUs to the independent developers. Even if Broadcomm changed this policy (which I have not heard of), you simply cannot trust the chip vendor with this track record. IMHO, investing any effort into rPi is a dead alley if you have any plans of "selling these boards to rural Africa". Simply put, you are at the mercy of a single source who has a track record of using dirty practices against the competition. This is contrary to the idea of open design. I am currently working on a BeagleBone which I selected precisely because I can buy the processor chips from Texas Instruments who has never refused to sell their chips to anyone. I am not impressed with performance, quad core or whatever. My only concern is whether I can build what I design, and then "sell to rural Africa". Therefore, the rPi is completely ruled out forever. Visit www.beaglebone.org and you will be impressed with the software projects that Beagle is running. You will quickly see that the Begle is *the* platform, rather than just a platform. There are many cheap boards around, but I found only one which: -- is cheap -- is open source -- can be redesigned or cloned -- you can actually build your redesigned versions -- has a backing by a large company -- has a very active user and developer community -- is running a wide variety of software, including several Linux versions For these reasons we are now investing effort into designing our own Beagle clone to suit our needs. The clone will be commercially available from our company when the work is done. Wojtek

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Re: [Oberon] Oberon / Linux Revival
by Treutwein Bernhard 25 Feb '15

25 Feb '15

Joe, > ./olx works brilliantly on ubuntu 12.04 (32 bit) interesting. On both TinyCore (see http:// tinycorelinux.net/) and SLED (11.0 SP3) it requires fiddling with the access control of X. Peter suggested xhost +, which works nicely with SLED, but TinyCore does not provide xhost by default, so there I had to restart the X Server after having edited .xsession to include -ac before the -I option on the Xvesa command line and killing the X-server with Ctrl-BackSpace. Oberon Linux Revival (11.6MB) & TinyCore should allow for an Oberon System on current PCs with a footprint lower than 25MB Disk Space ... -- Bernhard

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Project Oberon Emulator Compiling Issue
by Bill Buzzell 22 Feb '15

22 Feb '15

>>Oberon is a whole new world compared to conventional operating systems. Note the difference between the following two commands: Thanks again Chris. I didn't realize the "The Oberon System" book was so pertinent to Project Oberon. That's great news. I found it in PDF and it looks like plenty to keep me busy learning. Not many books around, it seems. I did find a well worn used copy I picked up fairly cheap. Apparently the Project Oberon's (FPGA) compile commands are slightly different than the emulator's commands, which I was getting by ok with. Now I understand the "in-place" compiling concept and all is well. Thanks again, Bill

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... wiki/Development/Repository and svn client.
by peter＠easthope.ca 22 Feb '15

22 Feb '15

In http://www.ocp.inf.ethz.ch/wiki/Development/Repository I've added a sentence referring to Apache Subversion and the manual at red-bean.com. If it is inappropriate, just let me know or delete the sentence or correct it. Also made the directory https://www.ocp.inf.ethz.ch/svn/ocp/trunk/peasthope/ with a spelling error in the log. Nothing more serious that I noticed. (A novice can be dangerous!) Regards, ... Peter E. -- 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 12 Tel +1 360 639 0202 http://carnot.yi.org/ Bcc: peter at easthope. ca

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Re: [Oberon] Project Oberon Emulator Compiling Issue
by Chris Burrows 21 Feb '15

21 Feb '15

> > From: Bill Buzzell [mailto:captbill279@gmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, 18 February 2015 7:27 PM > To: oberon(a)lists.inf.ethz.ch > Subject: [Oberon] Project Oberon Emulator Compiling Issue > > I am running the Project Oberon emulator on win7 64 and cannot get it > to compile even the "Blink.Mod". I keep getting "position 5 must > start with MODULE" if I do ORP.Compile @/s or ORP.Compile @. If I do > just ORP.Compile I get "new symbol file inhibited" (as expected). > > I have read chapter 12 of the book but can't seem to find where I am > going wrong. First I select (highlight) the Blink.Mod then I > interclick ORP.Compile @ command(s). Is there something I am missing. > I had a similar issue with the FPGA Oberon which seemed due to stray > selections which was overcome by careful selection order. Nothing > seem to work with the Oberon emulator, unfortunately. > > Obviously something fundamental I am missing has me stumped. Can you > assist? > Oberon is a whole new world compared to conventional operating systems. Note the difference between the following two commands: ORP.Compile @/s ORP.Compile ^/s The use of the @ version of the command is probably unfamiliar to you. It allows you to start compiling at any arbitrary point within the text of an Oberon source code file which is currently open. e.g. In the Oberon system you can have a document file with text and pictures and some Oberon source code in the middle of it all. If you open up this file using Edit.Open and select the start of the word MODULE in the text then you can use the @ version of the Compile command to start compiling from that point. I suspect you wanted to use the more conventional approach where you select the name of a file and apply the Compile command to that filename. If that is the case you should use the ^ version of the compile command. i.e. select the file name Blink.Mod with the right-mouse button to highlight it and then middle-button click on the command ORP.Compile ^/s to compile that file. If you are working on a new source code file (Xyz.Mod say) and want to compile it many times during development you may find it convenient to type in a new command into System.Tool (this is just a text file like everything else): ORP.Compile Xyz.Mod ~ And then you just have middle-button click on the command and it will pick up the name of the file(s) following it until the terminating ~. If you brain has been pre-conditioned by conventional operating systems it is likely that you may not have any conception of some of the features that are available in Project Oberon so you are unlikely to discover them by trial and error. Look out for a copy of the book: 'The Oberon System: User Guide and Programmer's Manual (ACM Press) Paperback – May, 1991. ISBN 0-201-54422-9.By Martin Reiser. The first few chapters gives a good overview of what is possible. Regards, Chris Chris Burrows CFB Software Astrobe: Oberon Microcontroller Development System http://www.astrobe.com

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Project Oberon Emulator Compiling Issue
by Bill Buzzell 20 Feb '15

20 Feb '15

I am running the Project Oberon emulator on win7 64 and cannot get it to compile even the "Blink.Mod". I keep getting "position 5 must start with MODULE" if I do ORP.Compile @/s or ORP.Compile @. If I do just ORP.Compile I get "new symbol file inhibited" (as expected). I have read chapter 12 of the book but can't seem to find where I am going wrong. First I select (highlight) the Blink.Mod then I interclick ORP.Compile @ command(s). Is there something I am missing. I had a similar issue with the FPGA Oberon which seemed due to stray selections which was overcome by careful selection order. Nothing seem to work with the Oberon emulator, unfortunately. Obviously something fundamental I am missing has me stumped. Can you assist? Regards, Bill

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Re: [Oberon] Oberon Digest, Vol 129, Issue 7
by "ɹǝzıuıʇnɹɔs ǝoɾ" 19 Feb '15

19 Feb '15

Bernhard, ./olx works brilliantly on ubuntu 12.04 (32 bit) > Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 11:13:03 +0000 > From: Treutwein Bernhard > <Bernhard.Treutwein(a)Verwaltung.Uni-Muenchen.DE> > Subject: Re: [Oberon] Oberon / Linux Revival > Hi Peter, > > thanks, I just tried it on a x86 system and this gives just > a "floating point exception" ... > > In the first moment I thought that this might be due to a 64bit > Linux, but it is a 32bit 3.0.101-0.42-pae SMP Kernel (SLED 11) > and the same happens with TinyCore 6.0 (Kernel 3.16.6 SMP). > > Any ideas? > > regards > -- > Bernhard

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Re (2): constraints in the A2 Installer.
by peter＠easthope.ca 18 Feb '15

18 Feb '15

> I think the last sentence should end with "?" Correct. > Does installation really need to change/overwrite the MBR? Only if you want to install BootManager. Andre's document is quite thorough. http://www.ocp.inf.ethz.ch/wiki/Documentation/BootManager > Even rPi:ARM relies of <DOS-booting>. BootManager is efficiently Spartan and functional in the Oberon style. ... P. -- 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 12 Tel +1 360 639 0202 http://carnot.yi.org/ Bcc: peter at easthope. ca

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constraints in the A2 Installer.
by peter＠easthope.ca 18 Feb '15

18 Feb '15

The A2 Installer insists on a storage part being selected and insists on formatting it, although there are cases where these steps would be inappropriate. For example, suppose the user intends to install BootManager on a device where an active flag set and a bootable system is already present. According to http://www.ocp.inf.ethz.ch/wiki/Documentation/BootManager#Howto the Installer can be used. To install BootManager at the front of a device, no specific part of the device should be selected. Nevertheless, Installer insists on a selection. A2 has commands Partitions.WriteMBR and Partitions.FileToPartition which should install BootManager just as in NO. I'll try it to be sure. Any reservations about an edit of the wiki documentation to address this case. Thanks, ... Peter E. -- 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 123456789 12 Tel +1 360 639 0202 http://carnot.yi.org/ Bcc: peter at easthope. ca

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